What do you think of the theory that Bruce died with his parents, and there is only Batman?
As someone who already functions in research psychology and observing human behaviour is a big part of what I do, I don’t think it’s not too far a stretch to say his innocence died with his parents and that this was a factor that led to his developing his ‘Batman personality.’
I do, however, think it heavily undermines the complexity of his character to say that nothing is left of Bruce Wayne and all that exists is Batman. That may be true in Frank Miller-land, but Batman is not who Bruce Wayne is at his core. He uses the image of Batman to induce fear in the criminals he encounters, but deep down, Bruce is a very human guy with real human emotions.
The fact that he does value family and human life is a huge part of why he actively works to preserve that. An outlet for his anger does certainly factor into how he operates as Batman, but it isn’t his only driving force for doing what he does on a daily basis. Anger is also not the only emotion Bruce experiences. He also experiences love, grief, and happiness as well.
If anger and Batman was all there was to Bruce Wayne, no one would be able to relate to his character at all. Anyone who seriously believes this is all Batman consists of has no real understanding of his character or the complexity of human personality.
The Eternal writers mentioned that they are thinking in a way to bring Cass Cain back. About what you said of Bruce Wayne,YES he's still the man who believes he's always right, he doesn't listen and he lies, but I think his portrayal in the New 52 is more human, he's not this "Bat-God", he shows his feelings and he's more adept to make mistakes or at least in his main book
With Bruce, I often find that his characterisation varies depending on who writes him, and some writers have a better handle on him than others.
In the New 52, I do agree that he hasn’t been written as a ‘Bat-God’ with a superiority complex, but his characterisation hasn’t been consistent either. Peter Tomasi and Scott Snyder have had a good handle on him, successfully balancing out his more negative traits with his more positive ones. Others I’ve found have struggled to do this successfully, often leaning towards writing him as that arsehole you want to punch in the jaw from time to time.
Either way, Earth-2 Bruce is still my favourite version of Bruce. I just wish he was still around.
It’s the seventh day of March, which means it’s already been March for a whole week. Time is flying way too fast and I don’t like it! I’ll wake up one morning and realise I’m a decade older than I was yesterday. Nonetheless, I’m pretty sure I still have a good 24 hours to answer your questions! :)
Things you may ask about:
1. General questions about the Huntress, Power Girl, or anything Earth-2. 2. What Huntress books to pick up to learn more about Wayne or Bertinelli. 3. Who I think are the best writers and artists for the Huntress. 4. Any clarification on continuity as it pertains to either version of the Huntress. 5. Any other questions about the DC Multiverse, characters, stories, etc. 6. Any other random question you feel like asking, including what I thought of Forever Evil #6, or how media (not just comics) gets science and medicine wrong all the damn time. (Excellent case in point: this week on Forever Evil #6, Geoff Johns demonstrated his ignorance of what asphyxiation actually entails. Particularly he missed the part about how cutting someone’s oxygen supply actually causes brain death before it leads to the subsequent shut down of both the respiratory and circulatory systems. If the goal is to potentially revive the victim in question later, asphyxiation isn’t the best way to achieve that goal. It’s more effective to mechanically stop the heart and later start it back up than go the more dangerous route of asphyxiation. Anyway….moving on).
Questions I won’t answer/won’t get posted: 1. Negative questions or opinions on other members of Huntress fandom. 2. Character bashing of either Helena Wayne or Helena Bertinelli. 3. Any personal information like where I live or where I work.
All questions will be tagged as ‘Ask Huntress Wayne’ and they may be asked using your username or anonymously.
We’ll begin later tonight with all the asks that have been sitting in my inbox this week! :)
what do you think of the portrayal of the batfam member in the new 52 and your opinion of characters that are (re) introduced in the batfam like: haper row, luke fox and steph brown
The current New 52 Batfamily is a shallow representation of all that was unique and interesting about it. The relationships between characters have been cut down in such a way that severely diminishes their importance to one another, and many of those relationships have been repurposed so that Bruce in particular maintains a status quo of the ‘lone avenger’ who rarely exhibits any human emotion, or anything that brings into question his hyper-masculinity. This has happened across two universes, one of which resulted in his death as a married man who loved his wife and daughter.
On the second half of your question, I don’t really have an opinion on those characters since I haven’t read many narratives with them. My DC fandom has largely revolved around Earth-2’s continuity than the mainstream one for the concepts this world used to explore pre-New 52.
At best, from what I’ve seen of Harper Rowe, I think she’s a fine addition to the Batfamily and has a lot of potential as a character. Luke Fox could’ve easily been introduced without removing David Zavimbe as a member of this family, and Stephanie Brown is fun, loveable character, I just wish DC Comics would stop pretending that her past history is irrelevant.
On a similar note, DC needs to stop pretending that other fan favourite female characters like Cassandra Cain don’t exist, or that characters like herself aren’t still be profitable given the strong fan following.
I don't hate New 52 Carrie, but I can see how the being "in name only" may negatively color other's opinions on her. Issue #25 of of Batman and... was originally solicited as Batman and Carrie Kelley and mentioned Carrie having a connection to Two-Face. I've seen it theorized that Harper and Carrie were being used as stand-ins for Cass and Steph, and getting permission to use Steph meant that Carrie was dropped.
I can completely understand being worried about DC’s direction with the character and how she gets presented to newer readers who are not familiar with the character. Those are legitimate concerns.
The point I was making is that isn’t a good argument since the same problem applies to various DCU characters, many of which exist ‘in name only.’ Many characters have been cut down in ways that made them less layered and complex.
Admittedly female characters suffer the most from DC reboots, but the point remains no one ever makes those same complaints about any of the male Robins who all look alike and exist in more redundant numbers than any of the female Robins. Even when people point out how very different the New 52 version of Tim Drake is from his superior post-Crisis counterpart, no one ever says he doesn’t deserve a place in the DC Universe for fear that his current portrayal may negatively affect fans’ opinions of him.
On people theorising Harper and Carrie being stand-ins for Cassandra and Stephanie, I can understand why people feel that way given DC’s track record with female characters in general. DC—for the most part—treats women as interchangeable in a way that is never applied to their male characters. They also tend to completely disregard existing fanbases for those characters and don’t always comply with fans actually want. I know this first-hand from being a Huntress fan alone.
If DC did decide to change their plans for Carrie in favour of Stephanie, then that doesn’t make sense because Carrie was already appearing in Peter Tomasi’s book and not planned for Batman Eternal as far as I know. I also recall Tomasi stating a while back that he did have long-term plans for Carrie, though I won’t be surprised either if DC decided to scrap those plans as well. If that is the case, then that most likely factored into the decision to rename the title of issue #25 from Batman and Carrie Kelley to Batman and Two-Face, even remove her from the issue all together.
The problem with the New 52 version of Carrie Kelley is that she's only superficially similar to the DKR version. If you changed her name and hair color she would be completely unrecognizable. She has also fallen off the face of the earth since the "Bruce goes through the five stages of grief" arc wrapped up.
I was not aware she had stopped appearing in Batman and Robin since I stopped reading it, but I suppose that makes sense since this past story arc focused on Harvey Dent. Maybe she’ll be back in future issues?
On the subject of Carrie Kelley being superficially similar to the version that appeared in The Dark Knight Returns, to be honest, the same is true for many characters appearing in the New 52. Many (if not all) DC characters in this newer DC Universe are shallow representations of the far superior versions that appeared in continuities past.
Nightwing had all of his relationships severed in the New 52 and is a lot less competent superhero than before. Superman no longer has any of the relationships that were important to him for the past 75 years and no longer embodies the best of humanity. Wonder Woman had her mythos cut down in such a way that stripped her of her feminist qualities and was reduced into being Superman’s girlfriend. Red Robin is something of a jerk now and no longer possesses any of the same skills set he had before. Huntress (Wayne) and Power Girl were stripped of their unique personalities and were reduced into stereotypes of women. Jay Garrick is now a young, dim-witted superhero and a slacker, and this list can go on forever.
So if Carrie being ‘superficially similar’ to the version that appeared in Frank Miller’s book is the best argument you’ve heard from people saying she’s an unnecessary addition to the DCU, those people haven’t been reading the New 52 at all. Either that, or they suck at forming a good argument.
Will terry mcginnis be a good edition to the dcu or will he (like carrie kelley) be an unnecessary addition to the dcu.
I honestly don’t have any problems with new additions of characters to the DC Universe. I’m more of a ‘the more the merrier’ kind of lady.
What I do take issue with is DC sidelining and even outright replacing minority characters for ones there isn’t a shortage of in the DC Universe. This is usually accompanied by a complete disregard for existing fanbases for those characters on DC’s part.
On the topic of Terry McGinnis, since he’s a character from the future, I don’t really feel he poses any threats to existing characters in the present timeline. At best, he’s one more Batman in a universe that already has more Batmen than it really needs.
I’m also not sure why Carrie Kelley is considered an ‘unnecessary addition’ to the DCU when those same complaints never get made about Jason Todd, Tim Drake, Damian Wayne, or even Terry who are far more redundant than Carrie, who is actually different. Nope, they are often featured in just about every Batman family fanart piece than even Batman’s own daughters.
Have you seen the unreleased pages from Catwoman #3 and #4 that Guillem March posted on his blog? What are your thoughts on them? What do you think Helena's reaction would be if she found out.
Echoing most reactions: I’m glad they never saw the light of day.
I don’t have any problems with nudity in itself, but within the context of the pages that were posted, it didn’t serve any real purpose in the story other than to function as eye candy for cishet male gaze. It was grossly exploitive of Selina’s character and both Judd Winick and Guillem March would have deserved all the flack they would’ve surely gotten for it should those pages have seen print. I’m pretty sure not even those guys would think of getting naked on someone’s lawn as a way of getting their attention, unless they were looking to get themselves arrested for indecent exposure.
It’s actually pretty disturbing to think that this book could’ve been tonnes worse in terms of quality than what it actually was under Winick/March. While Ann Nocenti hasn’t improved the quality of the book when she took over, even I find her wacky stories far more bearable than the grossly misogynistic rubbish we got from Winick/March.
As for what Helena’s reaction would have been should this have happened? I imagine she would’ve been pretty scarred for life. Enough to not make her want to approach the Earth-1 counterparts of her parents, and would probably feel for her mainstream counterpart if she was ever conceived.
Since DC announced their September event is going to tie into the weekly Future's End, where do you think Earth-2 is going to be five years from now? Do you think they will be the Earth the Prime Earth is going to go into battle with?
Who knows. It’s probable that this will be the event that brings Earth-2 to war with Earth-1. Or maybe Terry McGinnis himself comes from a parallel universe and it’s his world versus the mainstream Earth.
It’s still too early to say to be honest. At best, we’ll be lucky if Earth-2 isn’t serving Darkseid in five years time since that’s really the only major event this world has had over the last two years.
ok i am super confused after see worlds finest 19 and batman superman vol 1 # 9
now i know they say earth 1 & 2 its about 2 world, The earth 2 is Collapse so many people in world 2 move pararel to earth 1 ??
am I right??
so confused sigh… I just like Damian and Helena…
Owh sorry i mean, i am a new reader of DC comic so i can’t understand what the meaning of two earth.and another dimension ect… in dc comic
I am sorry for my post …. And thanks for the answer ^^
Thanks for the clarification!
Unfortunately DC Comics doesn’t make it easier for newer readers to understand the history of their own universe since they have a history of crashing and burning continuity and repurposing characters and concepts to meet whatever new status quo they want to go with. The New 52 is no different.
The idea behind Earth-2 isn’t actually new and had an established history before the New 52. The history may be difficult to understand at first since it hasn’t existed in the last two decades (courtesy of DC Comics reboots), but it was first established in 1961 as the ‘home’ where all the previous Golden Age stories took place. This meant that all characters and teams that appeared from (roughly) 1935 - 1955 were established as existing in their own universe, in this case, Earth-2. This effectively kept the Justice Society and All-Star Squadron in its own separate continuity from the Silver Age (1955 - 1970), along with the very first incarnations of Batman, Superman, Wonder Woman, Green Lantern, the Flash, Green Arrow, etc.
Since the original Earth-2 universe functioned in real time, all of these characters aged with the decades, which led to different kinds of narratives from the (then) mainstream Earth-1 universe. Earth-2 was the universe that first allowed Superman to marry Lois Lane, Batman to marry Catwoman and father the Huntress (Helena Wayne, debuted in 1977), Wonder Woman to marry Steve Trevor and give birth to Fury (Lyta Trevor, debuted in 1983), and so forth. Power Girl (Kara Zor-L/Karen Starr) also made her debut in 1976 as the Earth-2 doppelgänger of the mainstream Supergirl (Kara Zor-El).
Long story short, many of these concepts and characters aren’t actually new and have been around in the last three decades. Things got confusing for later readers when DC Comics made the decision to reboot their entire continuity from scratch with the 1985 maxi-series Crisis on Infinite Earths, which destroyed the multiverse and streamlined all characters and concepts into a single universe.
This streamlining of continuity created problems for the second generation Trinity from Earth-2 (Huntress, Power Girl, and Fury) who could no longer function without the existence of Golden Age/Earth-2 Trinity. This then led to DC repurposing these characters for the post-Crisis continuity by given them new origins. Helena Wayne became Helena Bertinelli in 1989, Kara Zor-L became Kara of Atlantis, and Lyta Trevor got new parents but kept most of her history intact. Damian Wayne didn’t actually make his debut until 2006 and was based off of a character that appeared in the else-worlds story Batman: Son of the Demon.
This now gets us to the New 52, which is a brand new continuity all together. The storyline that led to the New 52, Flashpoint, can be thought of as Crisis II since it once again rebooted continuity from scratch in 2011. The New 52 also reinstated the multiverse, which gave us back Earth-2 and Earth-3 so far. This subsequently reinstated the Huntress as the Earth-2 daughter of Batman and Catwoman—Helena Wayne—again, Power Girl as the cousin of the Earth-2 Superman (although she did get this origin back even before Flashpoint), and Fury is back to being Wonder Woman’s daughter, though who knows how much of her original history is still intact at this point.
Unfortunately Earth-2 got completely repurposed in the New 52 and no longer has the history that it once had. As of right now, the Justice Society is non-existent, and DC is rebuilding this universe entirely from scratch. That is to say, they’re making changes to this world left and right. So if you’re completely unfamiliar with Earth-2, there is no need for worry. All you have to do is pick up Earth-2 #1 and read the entire series to fill in all the gaps.
Sorry this was long, but hopefully this clarifies the idea behind Earth-2 for you. Feel free to ask questions if you want to know any specific details.
ok i am super confused after see worlds finest 19 and batman superman vol 1 # 9
now i know they say earth 1 & 2 its about 2 world, The earth 2 is Collapse so many people in world 2 move pararel to earth 1 ??
am I right??
so confused sigh… I just like Damian and Helena wayne
Sister brother form different world and earth ~ <3
I very2 want draw them so much
So amazing story, but so confused too… gyaaaa so crazy and so complex ==”
I’m not sure I understand the question, but if I’m following you correctly, you’re asking if there are more Earth-2 characters existing on the mainstream DC Universe and if Earth-2 is still around?
At the moment, Huntress and Power Girl are the only established Earth-2 heroes residing on the mainstream universe. I don’t know what’s the status of Kaizen Gamorra in the New 52 since he’s originally a Wildstorm character, but I believe it was suggested he’s the same guy Kara spent a brief night with on Earth-2 in the Worlds Finest Annual.
As for the status of Earth-2, it’s still around and even as a new group of superheroes. It’s just been turned in to an Apokoliptic hellhole where too much of the planet has been damaged in the fight against Darkseid. It was also that invasion that led to Huntress and Power Girl being transported to the mainstream universe where they’ve been stranded ever since.
I think that a lot of people are forgetting, Earth 2 was a precrisis creation. So a lot of readers who are more familiar with the "single Earth" DCU still have the mindset that Superman, Batman and Wonder Woman are members of the Justice League, and not the Justice Society. And many recent readers will find the JSA's similar trinity to be Flash, Green Lantern and Hawkman, when in fact back in the original publications Superman, Batman and Wonder Woman were just as influential.
I don’t think it’s so much a case of being ignorant of Earth-2 being a pre-Crisis creation as it is a case of many new Earth-2 fans being upset about the change in status quo with the current direction of the book.
Many were happy with James Robinson’s original premise of having a universe without the Trinity since they (Batman in particular) tend to steal the show from every one else. I believe it was more a case of being able to see the other JSA characters get the spotlight without being overshadowed by the presence of Batman and Superman in particular, and bringing them back to Earth-2 defeated that purpose.
I don’t agree with many of those fans’ assertion of having an Earth-2 JSA without the Trinity as founding members since they’re still very much a part of the team’s history and the reason Huntress and Power Girl became members. But I do, however, understand being upset about ‘breaking that promise’ of not having the Trinity on Earth-2 after going through the trouble of killing them off just to bring them back in some form.
A lot of people dislike the direction Earth-2 has taken because they believe the JSA should have nothing to do with Superman, Batman, and Wonder Woman. What are your thoughts on this?
It sounds to me like the comments you’re reading are coming from the current readers of Earth-2 and not anyone who has any knowledge of its history.
Batman, Superman, and Wonder Woman were actually founding members of the Justice Society along with the original Flash and Green Lantern and many other heroes from the Golden Age, including the original Black Canary, Dinah Drake.
As time went on and the Golden Age heroes began to age, many of the original Justice Society members began to retire with younger members taking their seats. This was especially true of Batman and Superman who eventually retired and their seats were subsequently taken by their daughter and cousin—Huntress and Power Girl—respectively. Wonder Woman was semi-retired but would occasionally join the team for Crises.
All that into consideration, I don’t believe that the Earth-2 JSA should deny the Trinity as it’s founding members because they are as much a part of its history as the Golden Age Flash and Green Lantern. It was also the inclusion of the Trinity that allowed for two of its prolific members, Huntress and Power Girl, to join in the first place. I also don’t think that their inclusion and acknowledgement hurts the JSA.
That being said, I completely understand fans’ frustration over the decision to bring Thomas Wayne’s Batman into Earth-2 after the initial writer, James Robinson, already made it a point to remove the Earth-2 Trinity in the first place. He did this by killing them off before any of us even had a chance to get to know who they were. I myself have legitimate issues with Thomas Wayne functioning as Batman on Earth-2 because his presence in particular repurposes the Huntress’ role on her own world.
I also completely understand the upset over the decision to revive Superman on Earth-2 as well, because his revival along with the arrival of Thomas Wayne has shifted focus away from the other Earth-2 characters. In my personal case, I was more upset over the decision to turn the Earth-2 Superman into the villain Brutaal than anything else.
The problems that exist with the Earth-2 book, however, are largely the consequence of poor decision-making far more than the presence of any of these characters. Rather than respect the history and legacy of Earth-2 and simply modernising the world for a newer generation of readers, DC completely repurposed this world so that it essentially functions as their equivalent of Marvel’s Ultimate Universe where they can dump all of their worst ideas possible and get away with being able to have their cake and eating it too.
I would say the repurposing of Earth-2 along with many other problematic developments is what ultimately got me to drop the title all-together. DC is making progress in the way of including more racially diverse characters on Earth-2, but their treatment of the Earth-2 women needs work.
Congratulations on your 500 followers! Aside from my mate Jen (who runs The Bat and The Cat here on Tumblr), your BatCat blog is one of my favourites to visit and I love reading your insight on the pair. :) Definitely keep up the good work! For your 666th follower, I highly recommend doing an Apokolips themed post. I did that back when I acquired my 666th disciple, which was all kinds of fun. ;) I'm now up to 868 and still thinking about what to do for when I reach 1000 followers.
dontmakeafooloutofyourselfdontmakeafooloutofyourselfdontmakeafooloutofyourself *take deep breaths* *pretend to be totally cool and laid back*
What, that old thing? Well, I like to keep a clean shop. No wait, that doesn’t make any sense… Damn it, let me start again!
Thank you SO much, your praise means A LOT to me since I’ve been a fan of you and your topic, analyses, and reviews since way before I even had this tumblr account and you were one of the first people I subscribed to. And when you unexpectedly returned the favor… Well, I didn’t treat that occurrence any differently, really…
You treat Helena - character/life/history/costume/family/creators - with much respect and passion while teaching us about her and bringing her back to the foreground of people’s memory. I love and admire that. You deserve every single one of those 868 followers and more! The big 1000 won’t take long.
Again, thank you so very, very much! Now I’m officially HuntressApproved! Let’s celebrate with a HelenaHuntress picture!
And for those with special taste - a HelenaRobin picture!
Special Note: As I touched upon in my review for Batman/Superman #8, there have been many flaws throughout Paul Levitz’ run of World’s Finest that resulted in a lack of build-up for this story. Many of those flaws have already been discussed in past reviews, including the one I did for Batman/Superman #8. As such, I don’t see the point of addressing those same problems again for this issue.
While the first half of issue #20 is admittedly better than what we’ve seen of Levitz’ past work on this book, many of those same aforementioned flaws remain present here. As such, there are major inconsistencies in characterisation between Pak and Levitz, and there are even forced, last-minute developments that are literally as old as a month ago. The only improvement Levitz made here was better execution of plot.
Lastly, the MAJOR plot point that ruined this issue for me was the complete mischaracterisation of Power Girl in the second half of the story, which was so ungodly out-of-character for her, it ultimately factored into my decision not give a full review for this issue. Even the way her part played out didn’t feel like a natural course of action given the build-up that led to her spoilery scene, which made it feel contrived in a rather irritating way. Even with the current characterisation of Power Girl in the New 52, it still didn’t make sense. You will see what I mean when you get to that part of the summary.
Without further ado, this summary is for everyone who is currently reading Batman/Superman and doesn’t want to drop the book because it’s tied to another book they’re not currently reading. I still recommend buying the book since Pak’s issue is still solid with great character moments and excellent artwork from Jae Lee.
Spoilers ahead obviously, so don’t click on this yet if you intend to read the Worlds’ Finest instalment of this crossover.
Worlds' Finest #20: Should I Review It? Yay or Nay?
I’m conflicted about this one.
On the one hand, it was surprisingly good for the first half with a few minor issues. But then, Power Girl’s characterisation in the second half was so ungodly out of character, it legitimately pissed me off to the point where I have a feeling I’m going to go off on a tangent if I begin to discuss that part of the narrative.
I’m also tired of addressing the same problems I’ve already addressed a 1000x over with Levitz’ piss poor characterisation of Power Girl in general.
So, help me out here, guys. Should I review it? Yes or no? If ‘yes’ I’ll do my very best not to go full force on that part of the narrative, and if ‘no,’ I’ll just post a summary.
Summary: In the prelude issue of Worlds’ Finest #19, Huntress and Power Girl separately made the decision to seek the help of the mainstream Batman and Superman in an effort to help stabilise Power Girl’s fluctuating powers. That issue ended with Huntress breaking into the Batcave and Batman capturing her, which is where issue #8 ofBatman/Superman picks up.
How do you feel about people mistagging the Huntress on Tumblr? Is there an easier way to tell the difference between the two?
To be honest? I don’t really care anymore.
To start with, I’ve completely divorced myself from Huntress fandom to the point where I don’t even know what goes on in the tags anymore outside of what get’s posted to the Helena Wayne tag. I’m also away from Tumblr for most of the day except for very late at night (in my time zone), which means most of the time I don’t even catch people who mistag the character. Helena Bertinelli very rarely shows up in the Helena Wayne tag, and whenever that happens, I always see that somebody else already pointed out the discrepancy to the person who did the mistagging.
As for whether or not there is an easier way to tell the two apart, unfortunately there isn’t. As I’ve said before in the past, the problem with the Huntress has always been a DC Comics problem. It was the management at DC Comics that made the decision to change the character’s origin from Helena Wayne to Helena Bertinelli after Crisis on Infinite Earths rebooted continuity, and it was DC management that decided to reinstate the character as Helena Wayne after the Flashpoint reboot.
The only way you can really tell for sure these days is to be aware of the which books were published in what era of DC Comics, and knowing which books the character appeared in across those different eras. All of the pre-Crisis (or pre-1986) Earth-2 Justice Society and Earth-1 Justice League narratives that have featured the Huntress have always featured the Helena Wayne version of the Huntress. This is true even for the pre-Crisis Batman narratives that have featured the Huntress. There was NEVER an Earth-1 Helena Bertinelli Huntress in the pre-Crisis Continuity.
In all narratives that have featured the Huntress from January 1989 - August 2011 have always featured the Helena Bertinelli version of the Huntress. With the exception of the Geoff Johns run of Justice Society of America, Infinite Crisis, and JSA: Classified—all of which featured appearances of the Earth-2 Helena Wayne Huntress in the post-Crisis continuity—only Helena Bertinelli functioned as the Huntress.
After October of 2011 which reinstated Helena Wayne as the Huntress for the New 52 continuity, there has never been a Helena Bertinelli Huntress in existence. The ‘Helena Bertinelli’ Huntress that appeared in the Huntress: Crossbow at the Crossroads miniseries was revealed to be Helena Wayne who used the name ‘Helena Bertinelli’ as one of her aliases. It was further established in the Worlds’ Finest narrative that a Helena Bertinelli who was a member of a crime family did exist, but had died at some point before Helena Wayne acquired her name for her civilian identity on the mainstream Earth. Furthermore, Forever Evil did establish the existence of a ‘Frank’ Bertinelli and his family, but whether or not this will change the status of the currently deceased Helena Bertinelli remains to be seen.
I admit it starts to get confusing once you get into New 52 territory, but the main thing to get here is that all Huntress appearances in the New 52 have been Helena Wayne. There has never been another Huntress prior to Helena Wayne’s arrival, which makes her the only Huntress in existence. Since the New 52 is still relatively new, this status quo could still change in the future if Helena Wayne goes back to functioning as the Huntress on Earth-2 and Helena Bertinelli turns up alive and ends up taking over as the Huntress on the mainstream Earth. But for now, Helena Wayne is the only Huntress.
It will require some research on fans’ part to know which comic books feature which Huntress, but to summarise:
All pre-Crisis narratives → Helena Wayne 99% of all post-Crisis narratives → Helena Bertinelli All current New 52 narratives → Helena Wayne
How was Bruce characterized in Batman/Superman #8?
It was hit and miss to be quite honest. There were some good character moments with Bruce—largely in the beginning of the comic—but for the remainder of the book, he was made to look like a colossal jerk.
At best, I liked that Huntress wasn’t depicted as being impressed with his dickish behaviour or being willing to put up with it, and she did ‘let him have it’ at one point. But it also felt like a forced, out of character development for Bruce since (a) he doesn’t strike me as someone who would disrespect his own daughter (even if alternate) with a sexist remark, and (b) it felt like his dickery was done for no other reason than to make him look bad. That is to say, he was made to look bad in a way that was meant to elevate the other characters.
The Wake by Scott Snyder is amazing, I belive you'll like it. Also Green Arrow by Jeff Lemire and Andrea Sorrentino. Batwign by Jimmy Palmiotti is good
I heard good things about The Wake, though I’m trade waiting on that one since there’s only so much money I have to spend on comics every month.
I did read the first story arcs of Green Arrow by Jeff Lemire and Andrea Sorrentino, which was actually great work. I definitely loved Sorrentino’s art the most, but have since fallen behind on the story due to budget. I’ll probably pick up the trades for the current arc once they come out.
I also enjoyed Batwing as well, but lost interest in it when we lost David Zavimbe as Batwing. I’m sure Palmiotti is doing great work on the book and Luke Fox is probably an interesting character, but I wanted to keep reading about David since I found his story very compelling. He’s also not appearing in anything right now from what I’ve seen. :(
another anon, batman issue 29 seems interesting (for what we see in the preview), seeign small bruce interactign with his parents it's kind of sweet to read :)
I saw the preview as well and I agree the flashback pages with Little Bruce were sweet to look at. :)
Unfortunately though, the main story hasn’t been that interesting after the Red Hood gang storyline concluded. It doesn’t feel as though the Riddler is the main antagonist but more of a background player. There’s also not a whole lot of ‘riddling’ leading up to a larger elaborate scheme like you would expect from the Riddler. Or at least, I’m not ‘feeling it.’ :(
I do read other comics. Right now I’m finding myself reading and enjoying more Marvel titles like Hawkeye, Black Widow, Ms. Marvel, Young Avengers, Loki: Agent of Asgard, and up until recently, Cataclysm.
My reading of DC Comics tends to be rather sporadic these days, only picking up story arcs that look interesting to me. As of right now, the only books I am picking up are Batman/Superman and Worlds’ Finest for the First Contact crossover, and the Forever Evil mini. I’m not sure if I’ll follow that to the end since I was bored to tears with issue #5 this month.
I was also following Zero Year in Scott Snyder’s Batman, but lately I’m feeling as though this story arc is dragging on for far longer than it needs to and I was bored with the last couple of issues as well. So I’m not sure if I’ll follow this one to conclusion either.
After March, who knows what I’ll be picking up from DC at that point. I do know I’m going to keep reading Batman/Superman for the upcoming arc with Lois Lane and Catwoman, but I’m not sure if I’ll keep following it after that story arc. If they give Lois Lane her own solo series following her well written one-shot that I got this month, that may be the only book I buy regularly at this point.
Other comics I enjoy reading are European comics, especially Bande Desinée. I’m especially fond of François Schuiten’s stuff. I also like reading manga, though lately I’m having trouble finding books to read that look interesting to me.
How would you react if Tom Taylor took over Worlds' Finest?
I would pick up a Tom Taylor-written Worlds’ Finest book in a heartbeat.
Even though I feel DC Comics only gives him problematic concepts to work with whenever they give him books to write, I do like Taylor’s writing on its own.I do think he can do an excellent job at developing the book’s characters and past on Earth-2, given his past character work that he’s done.
I did like the work that he did with the Earth-2 Bat family in the Annual and I would like to see more of that. I also would like to see his take on developing the pre-Apokolips Superman family since he’s a huge fan of those characters as well.
Do you think that they are incorporating to much of the new gods into earth 2? At the end of justice league 23.1 it showed a bunch of superman corpses and a type of franken-superman is this the same superman currently in earth 2?
I think that Earth-2 is deviating too much from the original concept, and yes, I do think that Apokolips is taking too much centre stage in its narrative.
The ‘Frankenstein’ Superman you’re describing is regrettably the Earth-2 Superman, aka Power Girl’s cousin. The decision to turn the Earth-2 Superman into a brainwashed disciple of Apokolips coupled with the decision to turn Lois Lane into a robot got me off the Earth-2 train for good. :(
So based on the recent first half of First Contact, it was established that Superman of Earth 2 was/is Helena's godfather. What are your thoughts on that?
It is actually very consistent with the pre-Crisis continuity, which means I absolutely approve of this development. It does make sense to me that Lois and Clark would be as much a part of Helena’s family life, along with Wonder Woman who were all very close friends with Bruce and Selina. So I am very grateful to Paul Levitz for preserving that aspect of Earth-2’s history.
Here’s a scan of the pre-Crisis Helena describing her childhood with the Earth-2 Superman to Power Girl! :)
if Helena W. could team up with other member of the batfam, who would be? i always thought that the dinamic between she and Jason T. would be interesting or characters like Steph, Barbara
I more than anything would love to see her team-up with the mainstream Selina Kyle, largely because it’s never been explored before, and I would love to see how these two characters would play off of each other.
It would be very interesting to see how Catwoman would react to having an adult daughter with Batman who is close to the same age as herself, and I would definitely love to see how many mental notes Helena would make of the mainstream Selina that compares to her own mother on Earth-2.
Did you enjoy the characteration of Huntress and Power Girl on Batman/Superman 8?? do you like Jae Lee's art and how he he portrays Helena and Karen?? quite elegant, i've got to say :)
I did actually! It was very refreshing to see a completely different take on Huntress and Power Girl, and fortunately we got it from Greg Pak. :)
And I’m also a huge fan of Jae Lee’s art. I know it’s not conventional for the genre he’s drawing for, but the unconventionality of his art style is part of the appeal for me. I’m quite fond of the surrealistic imagery, which in my opinion, helped to humanise the characters and make the moments between them feel that much more powerful. I also liked the consistency between this story arc and the first one that took place on Earth-2. :)
Ooh…this one’s tough cause I have so many favourites. :o
But if I have to pick an absolute favourite of all time it’s the Justice Society of America Annual #1.
Not only was that the first Helena Wayne story I’ve ever read, but I really loved her scenes with Power Girl in that story and the powerful character moments between them.
I found myself wanting to see more of that friendship following that story, and fortunately we have them back together in the New 52. I just wish they were both written with more depth like in continuities past.
How would you react if they decided to make an Infinity Inc cartoon or TV show? And if they did make one, what would you like to see in it?
I, for one, would definitely watch it, and as for what I want to see in it? I definitely would love to see the original cast members as well as the Justice Society. Also, I want it to be based exclusively on Earth-2 continuity, using nothing but Earth-2 characters. :)
Different anon, but I always wondered if you were Aeka on Scans Daily. You seemed like the only one who posted about Helena Wayne on there. (Btw, did you get your name from the Tenchi Muyou! character?)
Haha, yeah I do seem to be the only Helena Wayne fangirl on there these days. :P
And yes, I did get my username from the Tenchi Muyo! character. I had my LJ since I was 14 years old and back then I had a love affair with the character’s hairstyle. Most of the fanart that I did of her as a teenager was because I loved drawing her hair. I also loved her colour scheme of purple, red, and blue.